Notes From A Native Son Of The Rock. fnpsr reminds: Quote:

“Let’s fix the little things before we attempt to fix the big things.”

A keen eye prayed that Quote:

Heaven Help The APUA Engineers, The Operators - be they Nationals of the Peoples Republic of China or of Antigua & Barbuda -

In any Developed Country jurisdiction, the Employer would have been fined and the Operators reprimanded. Never rain on the parade. Quote:

Hazards exist in every workplace in many different forms: sharp edges, falling objects, flying sparks, chemicals, noise and ... other potentially dangerous situations. The Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) requires that employers protect their employees from workplace hazards that can cause injury. ... provide personal protective equipment (PPE) to their employees and ensure its use. PPE is equipment worn to minimize exposure to a variety of hazards. ...gloves, foot and eye protection, protective hearing devices (earplugs, muffs) hard hats, respirators and full body suits.

Given the A&B Review to reach Caricom Standards see www.ilocarib.org.tt/projects/labour_legislation/reviews/ant_review.pdf

Notes From A native Son Of The Rock. U have focused on the correct areas of investigation. On A&B, folks focus on the sensational - a carnival of emotions - whether the engines and generators are old. These have some value but in the industry, rebuilt and refurburshed equipment is accepted. 3 yrs ago, A Masterplan was developed for a cogeneration plant at a major US institution, $65M USD not including the Building and infrastructure. No illusions that the turbines would be new or refurbished. The focus was on: The Specifications and Operating Characteristics , The Efficiencies and ROI, Construction Management and importantly Commissioning. These questions in addtion to Financing were not addressed either by APUA or the Ambassador - was out of his depth. The GOAB needs to call on its Diaspora in such technical endeavours. A Project Manager would cost 1.5% and saved millions, spent 0.5%. They could have even gone to a Construction Manager, but more reponsible to an Independent Commissioning Agent. The existing substations and transmission infrastructure were designed over twenty years ago. Tango? Are they adequate?
Heaven Help The APUA Engineers and The GOAB.

Message to the PM BS, the Ambassador and the honorable Chinese delegates.
and MAN B&W
On Monday many of us will be watching your press conference and Hope that you are ready to provide concrete proof and answers to the many questions we have .
On Monday may more outside will be learning more about this power-plant because uncle Sam has began to take this matter on in her media .. www.cbsnews.com/8301-505245_162-57370586/china-built-antigua-power-plant-said-to-be-flawed
"SO better come correct "as we like to call it.

If it turns out that we did not get value for money,( which i think was the case) or the enginges will not reduce electricity cost as promised,then the Pm /Shoul/ and persons like the blogger who calls him/herself InterestedD( who i beleive to be someone in the Govts pocket)should be charged with treason,this would be complete betrayal of a nation and nothing more than treason.knowing A,guans lately though ,they may talk for a few wks then sweep it under the carpet,the Govt will continue to act as though its Business as usual until they come up with they next legal ponzi scheme.

John French from reading that link, one of the things that stood out was that a feasibility study was done. The absence of thorough information about this projects benefits vs APC, means effectively one was never done.

Listening to Winston Derrick on Thursday feb 02, he stated the engineers at APUA felt they needed help in overseeing the proper construction of the plant since they had major concerns. There was an issue with the depth of the foundation which at one time brought the project to a halt. A company was recommended by APUA's engineers, however APUA board overruled going this route.

In the past I have read financial statements from international companies and they all mention currency hedges (as an aside why is apua not hedging fuel as all real utility company's do), I just find it strange that persons here would suggest such is not of importance when dealing with the RMB. The PM during the budget debate stated they realized this was an important factor and why they were able to get the bank to lower the interest rate from 3 to 2%
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Tenman,
Sometimes I wonder if you read well. Go back and raed my post. Take your time and remove the urge that you have to spin things out of context to suit your political agenda. Once you do that you will find that my post speaks to the likelyhood of the rate of increase of the RMB will be slower or it may even stagnate because the Chinese would not want their currency to be too strong to affect their export. I do not see how you quantum leap to such ridiculous conclusion about dishonesty because I showed in an earlier post that the RMB insreased by 27% since 2005.

I'm with you on that in Fact we should have gotten a CAT a solid American products would have cost less, better experts to work with proper pre delivery process and parts overnight if we need it. All we need is for LIAT to buy Chinese Airplans Chinese products are the worst in the world bar none, any arguments? They counterfit everything using inferior materials, any arguments? Remember tainted milk that killed many children? or sheet rock that cause houses to rot and make people sick. Who wat argue? Cum dong selector!

Notes From A Native Son Of The Rock. I commend you on your surfing. Below the A&B article is another more educational article which anyone who reads it will understand the processes, documented transparency and accountability that is expected of such projects. Prophec y Provides EPC, PPA, Project Financing Update on Chandgana Power Plant ProjectTenman, the issue of financial risk is raised in this article. Hopefully,many nationals will read this article and educate themselves on this process since fnpsr, Morris & this mere "voice in the wilderness" rather than question the age of the engines and generators pointed to the EPC process with emphasis on Financing and Commissioning which fell on deaf ears. Here is the URL:
finance.yahoo.com/news/prophecy-provides-epc-ppa-project-133000439.html
Heaven Help The APUA Engineers, The Operators - be they Nationals of the Peoples Republic of China or of Antigua & Barbuda - and The Nation of Antigua & Barbuda including Redonda.
Well Said, Go Well! Respect!

I will be very surprise if the chinese did not say that the engines are new. After all, what else do you expect them to say. if that is how new generators from china look then they should be ashamed. we need an independent investigation.

finance.yahoo.com/news/China-built-Antigua-power-apf-4199358123.html?x=0

we are making the rounds

Quote:

RE: MAN Says Engines Were New #25 guest2 » 2012-01-21 03:10
Lets agree on two facts. 1... 2. The RMB has appreciated by 27% since 2005 after the Chinese up peg their currency from the US dollar. Read more: http://www.caribarena.com/antigua/news/latest/99470-man-says-engines-were-new.html#ixzz1lHFkfG16

Guess 2, You strangely state that there is no need to be concerned about the currency since we have a good relationship with China. This sounds like a man saying because he and a known ** is close, there is no need for him to exercise caution even though all signs indicate he should. You yourself, in previous posts shown above, have used the increase in exchange rate as a reason for justifying the cost difference. You now argue we need not worry though all signs indicate we should. Honestly, I can only conclude that your arguments are dishonest.
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you are correct there are people here distorting the truth so here I go again. I, me no know if dem new R owl. me a wait till my repersentative tell me. I did see a copy of the loan agreement and no way in hell I, me would sign dat. you feel me...ME I don't believe we used the right process of verification... .ME...I am an independent. not ALP or UPP atlthough I have been know to support both sides depending on the issues and have disagree with both again on the issues. They both suck in my opinion but they both have good people supporting them..my people. The powerplant thing doew not belong to no party it is the property of the people of Antigua and we deserve to know what we are paying for...any BS so far? next I believe the Chinese could build manufacturing and ship the product back to china and create jobs in ANU. I believe you and D are the same person. but what do I know.

Guest2 no logical person could read the contract located at http://www.caribarena.com/antigua/component/attachments/download/128.html and conclude that APUA is directly expected to make the payments. This is what you and your new friend InteresteD suggested. The contract states on section 4.5 :
Quote:

The lender (EXIM Bank) shall open on its books a lending account for the borrower (Government of Antigua) entitled "( Ministry of Finance Account on Antigua, 3OMW, New power plant Project)'' (hereinafter referred to as the 'Borrower's Account') to record the amount owing or repaid or paid by the borrower...

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I know that they were going to come after you in full force. They cannot stand the truth. It just not fit their agenda. They have people posted on here specifically to attack the truth. It is pathetic. You are so correct about the disbursement of funds. Keep up the good works.

John French II, I concur.


"Let's fix the little things before we attempt to fix the big things."

Dear Caribarena ... Can you ask the PM 5 simple questions at this press conference please ...

1-Why is he breaching our rules and laws of parliament? How come we already have the Power Plant delivered and operating yet no information about it or the loan was made available to Parliament yet?

2-When will the press, public or parliamentarian s get a chance to see the full loan agreement, and all the contracts, and also get a chance to take a walk through of the power plant?

3-Are we able to use the full 30 megawatts of power right now if necesarry? If not, how much power is the plant capable of producing right now?

4-Even if the generators were made recently, It is still possible that it was made from old, used and cheap parts. Having seen the pictures does it not concern him at all that we could be stuck with a plant that can end up hurting us more than helping us?

5-Proper Energy is one of the most important elements for a country to obtain succesfull development. How can we develop succesfully as a Nation if we are having trouble with our electricity needs? Why didn't we get the best egenerators available?

I am not against the PM but any good lie if it is to pass as a good con game have to have a certain amount of truth in order for it to deceive a more intelligent group of people. I know you know that because you have been telling lies all day and we read tenman and you still telling us he is saying something other than the man is saying. You are a part of the charade obviously in fact you used to come on by another name. hise up your frock and show your goods. the move to bring China to the people is a wrong move and how many people can fit into the PM's office? the whole island need to show up cause this is very important to us and we don't need you to think for us and I would say all the people you called losers are way more inteligent than you sound right now and in most of your post. I know who you are. you still dating what's his name?

Notes From & Native Son Of The Rock. In the Developed World, many Developing Countries & SIDS,there exist Engineering Associations where the members are governed and sworn to a Code of Ethics. These Principles of Ethical Conduct provide and prepare Certified Engineers for the fulfillment of their duty to the public, the profession and fellow engineers - (in this case the A&B Engineering Association.) Quote:

shall act at all times with fairness, courtesy and good faith to their associates, employers, employees and clients, and with fidelity to the public needs. They shall uphold the values of truth, honesty and trustworthiness and safeguard human life and welfare and the environment.

The A&B Engineers (Registration) Act is silent on a Code of Ethics. It speaks to Quote:

The Engineering aspects of - (a) a public utility;

http://www.laws.gov.ag/acts/chapters/cap-153.pdf
Prudence suggests that the reporters, respectfully listen to the GOAB & The Chinese and only address questions to the APUA Engineers.
Truth & Justice the Antiguan & Barbudan Way devoid of "Ethical Badmindedness."

InterestedD, obviously you did not get the point that my post was a parody. I was only referring to the scheduled press conference. Knowing how things are in Antigua, maybe we will get the truth and maybe we won’t. The question is, at the end of the press conference, will we be more enlightened or will there be more speculations and unanswered questions?

The issue here is "Since the commissioning of the Chinese Power Plant at Crabbes on September 8, 2011, Opposition figures and sections of the media have attempted to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the arrangements and have suggested that the engines provided by a Chinese company are not new."

This is what the PM has to clear up. Failure to do so, would be a complete waste of time.

Please remember that I do not have a dog in this hunt.

The loan arrangement is another matter for another day’s discussion.

“Let’s fix the little things before we attempt to fix the big things.”

You speak as though you have absolute authority over the RMB. Please understand two things. The Chinese Government depend on export lead growth. If the RMB is to strong this is going to hurt them. It most likely that the RMB will increase at a much lower rate or remain stagnant. Additionally, if our relationship remains strong this issue can be taken care of on a mutual basis. The US 34 million savings already take some of this into consideration.

Just Hope that PM BS and his sidekick should saw it to because Chef just gt a call from his kin Negrodamus who predicts that the fat lady is clearing her trough and is about to sing loud and clear.. Chef just hopes it wont be in German or Chinese but in plain simple words that we can all understand..som ething like" this plant is old junk it is an economic trap and will set of environmental genocide "because if you think the plant is bad wait until you see what it will put into our clean Caribbean are with a power-plant located in such location that the wind will always cover our beloved country with the toxic exhaust anyone ever asked what comes out of this junk beside leaks of oil, some current and lots of toxic exhausts. some are now saying the plant was a gift from the Chinese well that like given some one a used condom,,, can still be used but would you want to????

Lard have mercy Chef almost burn his funge and fish, did Chef see it right It is a Miracle the blind can finally see at last that appears to be the case for interested D, Could it be true did we find a cure to fix stupidity and blindness. just now Chef saw a news Flash on USA CBS media : ANTIGUA Chinese power plant Flawed,Seem that Interested D saw it as well based on the first sigh of reasonable critical thinking in the last post.

So are you saying that the PM is so powerful that he can create a whole web of lies that the EximBank and the Chinese government are complicit with??? Really.....say that the truth is not necessary as spin and untruths are all you are concerned with......and it's 2 percent with a five year moratorium on payments....... that against what I read was a 9 percent interest rate on the Hadeed plants and payment was to be made right away!!!

You sound like an official because you seem not to get anything right. I left an Idea that work with other countries and I don’t recall voting for any Chiney man. Usually I don’t respond to idiots. I’ll make an exception for you. I have never doubted anyone new or old, I don’t know and still don’t know. I am waiting for my representatives to make good on the transparency thing. China does not represent us YET! The only reason you are so upset is because we are not buying your BS. Calling people names because they don’t agree with you is childish and makes you sound so not intellectual. You don’t even know the difference between an E and an I. it’s SKYEW I LL NOT SKYEW E LL. You don’t pay much attention to details do you? So you would like us losers to go YES SIR MASSER, would you…NOT

Greetings...the lyrics of the song, "there are more questions than answers, pictures in my mind that will not flow....the more I find out, the less I know". These words are so pertinent today, even though they were probablly written decades ago. Just like all the other inquiries conducted by the Government for the Government, AGAIN the taxpayers will be left holding the blade, bleeding slowly to death, while trying to defend themselves from these shysters. Maybe, the doctor who got fired can open his own medical clinic, sanitorium included also, because demand for his profession will be increased dramatically in the near future....NEARG ARITIST like AIDS is now an epidemic in our African Caribbean, African American, African European, African Communities, and these Chinese are fanning the flame and adding fuel to it....

This conference has to be a practical joke…I have no desire to listen to what will obviously be a "managed" press conference because it is extremely annoying to have one’s intelligence insulted by civil servants in a public forum. My take is that this has to be a very unintelligent brainstorm by those involved in the allegedly corruption to make the investigation go away…honestly don’t think it will work. People like myself are totally fed up with the stealing and bringing Antigua down on a daily basis.

Why do we need people from China to come all the way to Antigua to tell us that our government bought used power plants. If the PM cant tell the difference between new and old then i think he is sitting in the wrong seat......this is a case of the driver cant see!!

Looks like everyone has forgotten the cost of renting from APC

InteresteD if you would identity the specif accusation I may be able to provide a citation which comes directly from the PM. It was the PM during the hand over ceremony who stated that day that they borrowed an additional 5 million usd to upgrade the transmission system.
Quote:

During the ceremony, Spencer and Yang Xiang will sign the handover certificates, and PM Spencer and Ambassador Liu Hanming will sign the framework agreement for a 28 million RMB loan for the upgrade of the substation at Crabbes that will ensure the smooth amalgamation of the power plant into the power grid

see http://www.caribarena.com/antigua/news/latest/98350-new-power-plant-handover-today.html)
If the PM is saying this upgrade is needed how can he then state the 30 MW plant is fully functioning? I guess it is but not smoothly?
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guess 2 stop it, your conclusions ignore certain facts. The 2% does not include the addition interest payments of around 1.3%. Of more importance, where this loan is concerned is the foreign exchange exposure. I have already shown via cited reference that in one year the RMB appreciated by some 6% in comparison to the USD. Yet you Guess 2 prefer to ignore these factors, I have to wonder why?


..

In the matter of the Citizens of Antigua v. the GOAB

RE: Power Plants

Clerk: Mr. PM, would you raise your right hand? Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

PM: Maybe

Judge: Let the games begin.


“Let’s fix the little things before we attempt to fix the big things.”

The 2% is on the entire loan. Construction means the construction or putting together of the entire power plant. Everything.

Awaiting the spin on this one.Were there any thing in place,that no one could go up and spruce things up? New/old i was promised a reduction in my electricity bill,i am awaiting eagerly the fullfillment of that promise.You Mr Pm will not get away with this one like you did with the fuel variation promise,promisi ng to remove it,instead increasing it threefold which is causing me and many others great distress.

You are spot on. Keep it up. I know that you are going to come under fire but do not mind that. The truth will prevail. A 2% loan from the chinese results in atleast US$35 million dollars in interest. I have been trying to let these ppl know that a power plant is much more than engines.
Now that there is going to be a press conference, these ppl are already shooting it down. Nothing will satisfy them.

So we will be favoured with a press conference? At last? Has Spencer finally found a way to "fudge" the issue so that UPP supporters can wilfully continue to delude themselves? Will it be a staged affair like Eddie Mansoor's charade about the cell tower issue? I can hardly wait!

Tenman if you are proved wrong about the accusation you are making would you apologize? You see this continuation of false accusations by persons like yourself without actual facts makes your co.mments cheap and biased. Would you be man/woman enough to do so?

The Pm Spin Doctors did in included having to pay back the chinese 300m yuan loan tha'ts how he arrived at the bogus figure of 2.7 m.
He is also not telling the Nation that his Chinese plant is using an addition $4,000,000. per month in fuel...!!!!

Skyewell and others Re just confounded losers.......th e PM is bringing all the persons concerned to the full access of the press so that all questions can be answered. Yet Skyewell now does not want to believe what the Chinese officials are going to say because of some other created issue. The facts are that the EximBank bank has loaned 300,000,000 yuan to the Government for a Power Plant...not just engines! The exim banks pays the construction company direct ( which is state owned by China) after APUA certifies that the work has been done. No money ever comes into the hands of anyone in Antigua. There are no directors of any imagined company. Again the loan is for a Power plant not just engines. Storage tanks , buildings and a list of other items make a power plant. I await the presentation of the Chinese and look forward to Skywell saying that they too are part of the UPP

ONLY NOW?!?!?

It would be good if the PM could justify the 2.7 million yearly saving. Is it simply that we won't have to pay apc this 2.7 million yearly (which was stated by the PM in parliament) or is it that our expenditure will be reduced by 2.7 million yearly? The figures I have seen show me that using this plant will end up costing up more because the Chinese plant is more fuel inefficient vs the Hadeed plant, the interest costs and the foreign exchange exposure also make this a negative.

The PM needs to stop with the lie that the 30 MW plant is fully functioning. Its using an old transformer from the Tango plant which at best can deliver 15 MW.
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2% on the construction & how much on the equipment? Also it is very inappropriate to say that the opposition’s statement is "tantamount to an attack on the good relations between Antigua and Barbuda and the People’s Republic of China. If I am not mistaken it was the ALP government that fostered the relationship between Antigua and China and if ALP win the next election which is possible more now than ever they would have to continue the relationship. I would rather have the government investigate the claims and the possibilities of fraud along with the opposition (TOGETHER) then bring the findings to Parliament, and then if needed, bring in the Chinese to answer only if we find fraud on there part. China is not our government. I won’t be swallowing anything from them. It does seem to me that the so-called good relationship with China is with the government officials not with the people. Tell China to build a manufacturing plant for a product well used in China so we can create jobs, make that product and ship it back to the Chinese market & allow for grants to locals people to form partnerships with private Americans and big Corporations and leave government out.

Over 2 billion people in China and you folks want to keep poking them with a stick. Did'nt your mothers ever tell you don't look a gift horse in the mouth? or Chinese proverb 'Don't Tease the dragons'

the same media that our PM says is "yellow" he now has to sit with and explain all? how humiliating?

the press conference will be of no use without the agreements for the press to peruse.

another question for the press: "who are the shareholders of the company that sold the plants to APUA?"

they not new ,give us back our money now,says the prime minister